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Thread: SPOILERS! My suggestions to improve the final chapters.

  1. #1

    SPOILERS! My suggestions to improve the final chapters.

    First up I want to say great work on wrapping up The Banner Saga story. You guys did a tremendous job.
    However there are a few technical and story elements that I feel could be implemented to make the final parts of the story flow a bit better.
    First up there are the return to Arberrang segments.
    If, like me, you struggled with supplies and events this plays out perfectly. You keep returning only to find things getting worse and worse. It really hurt me seeing just how much of the city was falling and each desperate event to hold out a little longer felt tense and scary.
    However if you arrived at Arberrang with plenty of supplies and troops you may never return at all and that, well the story just doesn't flow very well.
    My suggesting to improve this experience is to add extra events along certain checkpoints during the ravens progress that automatically trigger if you haven't returned Arberrang in a while. Obviously don't automatically have the current return events trigger but instead events that would occur within the city (Such as food becoming so scarce that mobs formed to break into inner walls) that need to be dealt with, either by choices, battle or both that if failed could lead to some menders falling and the darkness encroaching or just lost days on the counter.
    These would be bonus events for the players that had prepared stockpiles and give them a sense of achievement for triggering them AS WELL AS a way to purposely drop the days counter, allow the darkness to encroach to trigger certain story events.
    Lastly I feel more needs to be done with the epilogue. The final part of a game is what most players remember so it's very important to leave them with as much as possible. Even if it's just text it would be enough. A brief bit of text describing what each character did after the events of the game would go a LONG way to making the player feel like their choices had more impact. Especially if you did specific character combination texts. I really wanted to see Ekkill tell Rook he valued his opinion of him.
    There really needs to be a small timeskip and showing the reunion of the surviving Ravens and Arberrang parties re-uniting.
    To Be Honest there is only one game I've ever played that did character and consequences of your actions endings right and that was Heavy Rain. For those that don't mind spoilers you can have a look here for how they played out: https://heavyrain.wikia.com/wiki/Endings as each event played in sequence with minor or major alterations depending on which characters lived and died.
    I know you've got a LOT on your plate still with survival and patching but please consider fleshing out the end of your game just a LITTLE more. It will go from good to unforgettable.
    Last edited by Kaaboose; 07-29-2018 at 09:19 AM.

  2. #2
    Skald Aleonymous's Avatar
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    The number of Returns was/is a big discussion... It's kinda oxymoron that those that power-played the game (reaching Ch21 with tons of Renown, 100s of clansmen, items, heroes etc) get to see less content and are left with a sense of "that was it?" in the end. I'm not sure if forcing both "good" and "bad" players through all the Returns is the best way to go, but I feel there has to be more "recompense". At the very least, the finale sequences could be extended/different for the optimal scenarios, e.g., they could present a less-destructed world, more optimistic visuals/text etc. Ironically, the most memorable and striking ending scenario is the worst one (Arberrang destroyed): seeing the Banner on the floor of the Great Hall with the Alette/Rook/Aldis "family reunion" scene closing up the Trilogy.

    All in all, I agree that the endings could be improved.
    Together we stand, divided we fall.

  3. #3
    Quote Originally Posted by Aleonymous View Post
    The number of Returns was/is a big discussion... It's kinda oxymoron that those that power-played the game (reaching Ch21 with tons of Renown, 100s of clansmen, items, heroes etc) get to see less content and are left with a sense of "that was it?" in the end. I'm not sure if forcing both "good" and "bad" players through all the Returns is the best way to go, but I feel there has to be more "recompense". At the very least, the finale sequences could be extended/different for the optimal scenarios, e.g., they could present a less-destructed world, more optimistic visuals/text etc. Ironically, the most memorable and striking ending scenario is the worst one (Arberrang destroyed): seeing the Banner on the floor of the Great Hall with the Alette/Rook/Aldis "family reunion" scene closing up the Trilogy.

    All in all, I agree that the endings could be improved.
    To be clear, There's no way I'd want players to feel penalized for having gotten this far, just give them some extra hurdles to jump. Having more clansmen/troops could result in an event in fights over food with solutions varying from Sending more to fight in hopes they'll die, arming the clansmen, giving out the food to other survivors, trying to talk them down etc. with varies different results. Having more supplies/troops/clansmen should present more problems, but also have solutions. At least that way you'll feel the pressure even if you're stocked as the story comes to a close.

  4. #4
    Skald Aleonymous's Avatar
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    Judging from how Stoic handled such feedback for Saga1 and Saga2, I doubt they are willing to do more than tweak/balance variables. In this spirit, I suppose that they would just tweak the "weights" under the bonus days given by the Arberrang defenders to the Ravens caravan (e.g. factoring-in the difficulty setting and using nonlinear dependence).
    Together we stand, divided we fall.

  5. #5
    Quote Originally Posted by Aleonymous View Post
    Judging from how Stoic handled such feedback for Saga1 and Saga2, I doubt they are willing to do more than tweak/balance variables. In this spirit, I suppose that they would just tweak the "weights" under the bonus days given by the Arberrang defenders to the Ravens caravan (e.g. factoring-in the difficulty setting and using nonlinear dependence).
    Ah well, Guess i'll just have to make to with a good ending

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